[AMC-List] Re; Trans for 232 six

["John Elle" <johnelle@xxxxxxxxx>]

For information purposes
 
Snip
The V-8 model should bolt right on. I'm willing to bet the V-8 has a
higher rpm stall converter than the six, so might want to get a new or
rebuilt converter.
Snip
However if you are scrounging from scratch that fact that AMC built
far more I-6 cars than they did V8 cars being able to get all of the 
parts off of one car to install a torque flyte transmission is much 
more probable. This would not only include the transmission, but all 
kick down linkage, mounts, brackets, speedo-cables nuts and bolts and
misc. stuff. As the flex plate for I-6's are neutral balanced it would 
not make any difference what engine you got it off of. Yup, V-8 stuff
is usable even if you have to take a BF Hammer to parts of it but for 
one stop shopping an AMC I-6 car will give you everything. For what it
is worth. 
 
Snip
Someone mentioned using this trans, or rather a lock-up version and a
high gear (2.53 or so) in the rear. I know AMC used a high gear like
that in Spirits
Snip
 
Yup, that was me, I have 2 1980 AMC I-6 cars using this transmission 
with this rear axle and they were available from 1980 through end of
production. 
The point being that this is at least one other transmission variation
that is available for back fitting and although the rear axle is
probably
not an alternative due to fit, it points out that this type of 
transmission can and did work with taller rear axles. As far as I know
there were two OEM style torque converters available for this
transmission
a high and a low stall torque converter. My AMX has the high stall OEM 
converter and my Spirit has the low stall converter as that is the one
I purchased for it. It was a mistake that eventually I will fix. The
transmission works better with the high stall torque converter as the
2.53:1
rear axle is a bit tall for the application but it is workable, just not
really so when you use the low stall (oem style) torque converter.
Something
2.7x rear axle might be better at. 'Specially if there is any additional

weight in the car you are switching in to. 
Two things to keep in mind though when contemplating the possible use of
This transmission. 
1-    the first 2 gears are shorter to compensate for acceleration with
a 
2.53:1 rear axle ratio. 
2 - The torque converter slippage is an aid for low rpm operation in
high 
and it does give you torque multiplication to aid in pulling the car 
around. 
 
Of course the torque converter locks up at some stupid vale of about 37
mph.
And this does create something of a slug for some types of acceleration.

By adjusting spring tension for the valve you can get it to lock up at a

more reasonable 55 mph thus improving in town performance on one hand
and 
still giving something in the area of 30mph/1000 rpm depending on axle
gear 
and tires in high leading toward decent on the road fuel economy. 
 
If you have to buy a converter I would opt for the higher of the 2 OEM
style 
Converters at the get go. I intend to replace my converter with a 2000
rpm 
stall lock up converter in the not too distant future for a couple of
reasons,
some mentioned others not. 
 
The point is again, in doing back fitting into older models if the rear
axle 
ratio is below 3.XX:1 there is a lot that can be done with the later
lock
up torque converter transmissions and some benefits to be gained.
Although I 
hear what Frank is saying my Stock 1980 fully smog legal and functional
258 
with the Carter BBD carbureted engine pulls the AMX around quite
adequately 
here in AZ through the city and hill and dale and 7% graded mountains.
No it 
aint a hot rod but it keeps up with traffic well and can get numbers as
high
as 28 mpg using a 2.53:1 rear axle. Now either I am getting more out of
my 
stock 258 engine than some one else is, but I really do not find the car
gutless
out on the road. At least under 80 mph. Keeping in mind of course that
75mph
is the state speed limit. 
 
Now with my Port Injected 1980 258 with a cam and some compression using
the
same transmission and rear axle but with bigger rear tires, it does not
take 
much sass from anything out there on the road. The transmission is
modified to 
lock up at 55 mph and it is adjusted to up shift from WOT passing gear
(2nd) to 
high (3rd) at 75mph and will do it with a firm hard shift. (even with
the A/C on)
Once again the versatility of the later design does have some benefits
that can
be used when back fitting components. There is no way I would purposely
install 
a rear axle in a like weight I-6 powered car that is much over a 3.07:1
just 
so I can wind out the long stroke I-6 and listen to it buzz at 75mph, I
don't 
even like my 390 winding along at rpm at that speed. I would preferably
want to 
run a gear in the order of 2.7x to 3.00:1 if I could but with in reason
 taller is better than shorter in my book for my applications. 
 
Long stroke in-line I-6 engines are not really happy at higher rpms, but
they 
can be built better to run hard between 2 and 4000 rpms and twist
tighter up
through 5000 rpm with out a whole lot of expense or problems.
 
But the bottom line is really this. If you are gonna bolt a whole bunch
of 
stuff together and expect it to run flawlessly the way you want it to
with 
out thinking about the ramifications of the parts you are bolting
together 
you are setting yourself up for disappointment. It is a little bit like
trying 
to use a computer program you are not familiar with and then wondering
where 
the DWIM button is. 
 
(DWIM - Do What I Mean)
 
        
For what it is worth 
John. 
 
 
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